Behind-the-Scenes: Rebalancing Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix (Part 11, T. Hawk Revisited!)
April 21st, 2008 Seth KillianThis is part eleven in an extended series of articles from David Sirlin, detailing the changes we’ve made to the rebalanced mode of the new Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix project. The previous articles can be found here.
This week we revisit the enigma wrapped inside a mystery that is T. Hawk, the world’s biggest Native American (who is apparently from Mexico). Hawk has spent a lot of time in the rebalancing lab, and Sirlin walks you through the dizzying highs and devastating lows of trying to get him juuuust right.
Part 11: The T.Hawk Chronicles
T.Hawk has been one of the hardest characters to balance (along with Fei Long and Honda). On the one hand, he has an extremely damaging command throw, a great Dragon Punch-type move, and an aerial dive. These moves could conspire to make him terrifying, so I understand why the original SF2 developers were so careful to keep him check. Hit the jump to get the full story…
Now that we have the benefit of 14 years of SSF2T history to look at, we know that they kept him a little too much in check (he’s considered a bottom tier character), but their decisions at the time are certainly understandable.
The thing that makes him especially hard to balance now is his all-or-nothing game plan. The “nothing” part happens when you spend the entire round trying to get in on your opponent and never do. I’d like to explain the “all” part for the uninitiated though. His devastating sequence is:
Safe jump jab -> low jab -> button-up command throw -> repeat.
That’s a lot of jargon, so let’s sort it out. I covered the concept of safe jumps in the advanced section of my SSF2T tutorial videos. The idea is that you jump at your knocked-down opponent as he gets up. You time your jump so that you land just a couple frames after the opponent is completely standing up. If the opponent chooses to do a reversal attack (such as Ryu’s Dragon Punch or Guile’s Flash Kick) then it actually won’t hit you. Those reversal attacks have a few frames at the beginning where you can’t hit them, but they can’t hit you either. So your jumping jab will pass through the opponent, then you’ll land (and block), then their reversal attack will start to hit—but you’ll be safe. Yes it’s hard to time this, but experts can do it.
If the opponent tries to do a reversal attack in this situation, you’ll just land, block it, and then be able to retaliate with a command throw. If the opponent decides to block, then your jab will touch him, forcing him to block. If blocks the jumping jab, he will be forced to block your subsequent ducking jab. At this point, you can perform the 360 on the joystick, then release a punch button. In Street Fighter, releasing a button (as opposed to pressing it) does count for doing a special move, but it does not cause you to do a normal move. So after the opponent blocks your low jab, if he does a move that makes him unthrowable (such as a Dragon Punch), then your throw will fail. In ST, T.Hawk does not have a throw whiff animation, so usually if you miss a throw, you get a normal punch instead. But if you tried to do the command throw by releasing a punch button (rather than pressing it) you don’t even get a punch if you fail to throw—you just get nothing, and you can block.
So after the opponent blocks your low jab, he will either get thrown or you will safely block his reversal attack (and then throw him anyway). At this point, you can safe jump jab to repeat the entire sequence if you are in the corner.
The bottom line is that although this loop is very difficult to execute properly, if you land it and you can execute it, you basically win. It also means there is a “perfect T.Hawk algorithm” once you get in the right situation. No real strategy is involved, it’s just a very difficult test of your ability to execute precisely. You could say that T.Hawk “needs” something this powerful, because even with it, he’s still bottom tier. But when we buff him up, it’s probably a bad idea to let him keep this. Because getting in is easier now (safe Hawk Dive), the reward should not be so great, and more importantly, the strategy should not be completely replaced by a dexterity test once you do get in.
Now check out my current change log for T.Hawk, starting AFTER the last T.Hawk article:
• Hawk Dive no longer knocks down. The reward for hitting was simply too great, allowing for crossup splash (fierce), stand short, command throw.
• Hawk Dive now falls slower after hit/block so that on block, T.Hawk does not recover before the opponent anymore.
• Hawk Dive now falls even slower after hit/block to prevent Hawk Dive -> low short or forward combo that was possible at a very certain height/distance. Difficult to perform, but too powerful.
• After command throw and super, T.Hawk now bounces farther away, and falls slower during the bounce. This prevents safe jump jab in the corner after a command throw, but still barely allows walk up low jab after a command throw (remember, the victim can hit your low jab with a reversal, but not the safe jump jab).
• Hawk Dive damage reduced.
• Hawk Dive startup time increased 4 frames.
• Alternate Hawk Dive added. New dive has incredibly fast startup, knocks down on hit, but is unsafe on block against many characters. Purpose is to allow T.Hawk to deal block damage to defensive characters such as Guile and also to give him back his knockdown dive if he’s willing to do the unsafe version.
• Both hits of low roundhouse given the ability to deal block damage (mostly to help vs. Honda).
• Change reverted: block damage removed on low roundhouse.
• Change reverted: Alternate Hawk Dive removed, the ultra fast startup wasn’t quite game-breaking in tests, but I can imagine it would be once released into the wild.
• Change reverted: Hawk Dive’s startup time reduced 4 frames, now matching original game.
• Change reverted: Hawk Dive’s damage set back to original game’s, entirely because block damage turns out to be linked to hit damage. Reducing the damage in an earlier change had the unintended effect of reducing the block damage also, so change reverted because he needs a way to deal some blocked damage.
• Throw whiff added when T.Hawk attempts the command throw, but fails to connect. Acts similarly to Zangief’s whiff throw.
As you can see, that was a lot of experimenting, and it didn’t all go well. You might argue that T.Hawk is even worse now than the original game because the deadly throw loop has been removed (can’t safe jump jab after a command throw and also addition of throw whiff prevents completely safe attempts at the command throw). But the flipside is that T.Hawk doesn’t have to be all-or-nothing anymore. He can mostly get in with the new dive, so getting in doesn’t need to lead to instant checkmate. He does have trouble against defensive characters like Guile and Honda, but I’ve managed to find at least some effective strategies in those matches, so hopefully he won’t be too bad off there. In other matches, he’s more well-rounded. His gameplay is more “interactive” now and less based on perfectly executing a throw loop, so this makes fighting him more fun. And when all is said and done, I hope players will find him more effective than he was in ST, just not game-breakingly so.
Although it took more tries with T.Hawk than any other character, I think he finally settled down into a reasonably balanced state. And every time T.Hawk wins a match by a lot or loses a match by a lot, I already know people will lean over to me and say “you think that’s reasonably balanced, eh?” Time will tell!
–Sirlin










He certainly seems more evenly balanced now than he did in the past. Can’t wait to try him out when this is released. =)
I think he will be more evenly balanced, but I will miss the days of beating people down by doing nothing but Hawk Dives over and over again
It’s some comfort to know that, even if it was never in a released Street Fighter game, T. Hawk was unquestionably #1 for a brief, shining moment…
Rock, paper, scissors let’s take it to the next level..
I understand that there are some limitations to the scope of any video game project however, reading this statement made me see an area for improvement:
Seth Killian wrote: “Safe jump jab -> low jab -> button-up command throw -> repeat.”
why not reward the fallen player who correctly anticipates a “safe jump”? what if there was a throw invulnerable move (like a dragon punch) that did no damage but had a quicker recovery than a dragon punch. This would take the Rock, Paper, Scissors element to the next level and add to the mind game.
just to explain the concept, lets call this move “rising whiff” (just humor me so i can try and make my point). Imagine a fallen player. If he correctly guesses (and times) that his opponent will safe jump than he does this move, “rising whiff.”
If the rising player is correct : then the safe jump fails the characters miss each other and the rising player has recovered and can then attack his opponent.
If the rising player is wrong (or if the move is mistimed) : Imagine if instead of a safe jump the player in the air does a regular jumping roundhouse kick, or fierce, then the player trying to get up is punished!
as far as project scope is concerned….implementing such a move is a lot of work (what would a rising whiff even look like?) Street Fighter is embraced by the world and over the years it has evolved. The fact that some opponents can time a safe jump, this technique is like a ripple. The changes that you are undertaking in some respects come into contact with this ripple. However, the suggestion I mention at least gives the rising player some options and may further enhance the Rock, Paper, Scissors element ….or not. Maybe a “rising whiff” move that had a quick recovery would result in punishing the player who has worked so hard to get in. I wish I had the means to test such a theory (I envy you Seth Killian). On the other hand, it’s no easy feat making changes that will please the legion of Street Fighter fans. Im glad I don’t have your job =]
what does T.Hawk have against people like Honda
and Guile? I think his rising eagle should be
more invincible when going up, that would be a
good counter to Honda’s torpedo, while countering
it with a diving hawk would result in T.Hawk knocking Honda out of the torpedo.
Against Guile, I dunno, his diving eagle is too slow
to get Guile cause GUile could quickly flash kick
even after throwing a recent sonic boom. a good Guile
is untouchable against T.Hawk. unless the jab rising hawks could quickly ans safely pass through sonic booms (kinda like Honda’s sumo splash).
Both of your suggestions basically work: you can “dragon punch” (aka Rising Eagle) Honda’s torpedo, or dive him out of it (in most situations).
Similarly Hawk’s DP can 1) hit Guile’s feet a little bit 2) pass through a sonic booms and hit Guile during recovery.
The dive is also NOT so slow that Guile can flashkick after throwing a sonic boom at all. Guile can challenge Hawk’s dive with some normal moves (like standing jab), but these are far from safe and work depending on the height from which Hawk does the dive. Also if they fail Guile is in deep trouble.
Overall Guile and Honda are still tough fights for Hawk (these are the nature of the characters), but he has chances and can still be devastating with a few clever choices.
Re: Rising whiff.
This is pretty interesting as a concept but in practice would not only be beyond the scope of the game to implement, it also wouldn’t actually help against a safe-jump jab.
You can whiff while rising, but the whole thing about safe-jumping is that you recover right away after your jump-in, so if someone was whiffing you could hit them instantly. At the best, both characters would be recovering at the same time and you could race to do a special move on the ground, or try and throw each other, or something?
I guess it would also be weird to perform a fancy and difficult input to perform a specialized “nothing.”
Overall safe-jumping is not a problem in general (VERY difficult when you consider that not only do the characters have different jump speeds and arcs, different opponent characters also get up from knock-downs at different speeds), it was just particularly soul-crushing with T. Hawk who could kill you outright at almost any time (pretty impressive for one of the worst characters in the game!).
The rather simple and low-tech answer to safe jump is the delayed get-up from C/P grooves in CVS2. However, given the importance of the wakeup game in ST (and SF2 in general), this change would alter the game so fundamentally that you might as well call it Street Fighter II-2.
There is a big, big difference between individual character tweaks and a wholesale gameplay engine change.
I agree with those saying that the safe jump in is a good part of the offensiveness of the game, and it should stay how it is. It’s just the all or nothing options that come out of the same jump ins that need tweaking.
I am really disappointed to hear that T. Hawk is no longer able to do safe negative edge SPD attempts. I always preferred T. Hawk over Zangief, since T. Hawk had no whiff animation for his command throw. Isn’t it a possibility to nerf another aspect or make him jump further backwards after a SPD? His negative edge goodness has always been what made him so interesting to play.